Śrīpāda Bhāgavata Mahārāja: We want to take all headaches from you. We don’t want you to have any headaches.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But I think that I have no headache. I am very happy to preach all over the world, and all sincere persons are coming by love and affection. I want that you will all continue in this way after me. Do everything like me, with love and affection – not by controlling.
Śrīpāda Bhāgavata Mahārāja: ‘After me’ will be after a long time.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Very soon I will tell my preachers who are preaching in different areas that I will not go to those areas to initiate. They should give harināma and also dīkṣā, and thus continue the mission. After my departure, and also while I am still in this world, I will allow all to preach and make disciples in their areas.
But do not be like ISKCON leaders. They quarrel with Vaiṣṇavas and don’t honour them; especially they don’t honour senior Vaiṣṇavas. I want everyone to give respect to seniors, whether those seniors are gṛhasthas or sannyāsīs. I request the sannyāsīs not to think, “The gṛhasthas are controlling us. They should not come.”
Problems always come, and they will continue to come in the future. At the time of Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī Ṭhākura Prabhupāda there were so many problems, and my gurudeva even had to go to jail. But pure Vaiṣṇavas always keep their feet on the head of problems, and I do that as well. Problems come, but I keep my feet on the head of problems.
In ISKCON, almost all sannyāsīs have gone down and left sannyāsa. Then, new ones are coming and making their pockets heavy as well. Still, to this day, I have no bank account nor do I keep even one paisa. Vrajanātha and Rādhā-kānta and Yaśodānanda have accounts, but I do not. I have something in pocket, but not in my pocket. Everything is in the pockets of Mādhava Mahārāja and Vrajanātha, and Vrajanātha keeps all the accounts.
I have not done anything for myself; I have not kept even one paisa or shilling. Be selfless like me, following in the footsteps of what I have done for the mission – preaching, establishing preaching centers, and helping others.
I also want a ladies’ āśrama for ladies who are orphaned (who have left their home and family); either here in Gopīnātha Bhavan or outside. Also, I want a school in Vṛndāvana for the children of devotees.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Why are you worried?
Kiśorī-mohana dāsa: I am worried because two days ago, after the meeting, you said very clearly, “I will stop travelling. My disciples, the preachers, will be travelling everywhere, and they will be giving harināma and dīkṣā.” And then you said, “They will make their own disciples.” My worry is that everything I have heard from you for the last eleven years about the qualities of guru, guru-tattva, who can give dīkṣā, and what is the definition of dīkṣā – it seems like it was all smashed to pieces at that moment.
I want to understand from you how someone can give dīkṣā who does not have realization of his own relationship with Kṛṣṇa and who cannot see the svarūpa (form) of the soul. I don’t understand.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: You should not be worried about that. [Indicating some Western sannyāsīs in the room] Those sannyāsīs who are preaching my mission everywhere are madhyama-adhikārī. I think they will not deviate; I have that faith. Only a few went, like Prema-prayojana, but I have no doubt about these sannyāsīs. The Indian sannyāsīs, like Vana Mahārāja, Tīrtha Mahārāja, and Mādhava Mahārāja, are qualified, and they are also madhyama-adhikārī.
For my gurudeva, I am giving initiation, dīkṣā, and even sannyāsa. So, I want that, in my lifetime, those who are qualified should do the same. Thus our paramparā will continue. I would like that.
If they are madhyama-adhikārī, they can give initiation even if they have no realization. I have been giving initiation for the past forty years, since our guru mahārāja ordered me to do so. We should obey our holy master, our spiritual master. But I also want them to be qualified.
I have not told this for the gṛhastha-bhaktas. I have said this for these sannyāsīs – that after some time, in my lifetime, I am allowing them to initiate. After some time I will stop travelling and if I have energy at that time I will write books as I am doing now. And at some time, if my health is okay, I may go one time to America, or one time somewhere in the East.
You should all preach my mission.
Vrajanātha dāsa: Gurudeva, but you will also continue to accept disciples.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Oh, one thing more. The sannyāsīs are going to all the places, but if any devotee wants that,
“I will take dīkṣā and harināma from Mahārāja.…”
Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja: From Gurudeva.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They will come to me, and I will initiate them.
Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja: Direct or by phone; in some way he will give.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But those who are satisfied by them should take initiation from them.
Kiśorī-mohana dāsa: But how do we continue to preach guru-tattva – pure guru-tattva?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They will preach as I preach guru-tattva.
Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja: Gurudeva is saying, “If they want, they can take initiation from me.” Gurudeva is happy to give them initiation.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yes. I will give. But if they are satisfied by the sannyāsīs, oh, no harm.
Śrīpāda Padmanābha Mahārāja: Śrīla Gurudeva, Kiśorī-mohana’s concern is that our siddhānta, and what we have heard from you, is that the bhakti-latā-bīja (the seed of devotion) and one’s relationship with Kṛṣṇa can only come from a Vaiṣṇava who is on the high-level uttama stage. What will the disciple be receiving if he receives dīkṣā from a lower Vaiṣṇava – a madhyama or.…?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: By the order of Gurudeva, the disciple acts like a postman. The postman gives money, money orders, and everything else, but that money is not his. Similarly, that ‘money’ is Gurudeva’s, and thus he is distributing to all.
They can take what I am saying in this sense. They should not think, “I am guru.”
Śrīpāda Bhāgavata Mahārāja: Last year in Vaṁśī-vaṭa, you told me that only the vraja-rasika-uttama-adhikārī (the self-realized guru who is an associate of Kṛṣṇa in Goloka Vṛndāvana) can give the bhakti-latā-bīja.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It is true. It is true.
Śrīpāda Bhāgavata Mahārāja: Then I asked you, “Can one who is coming up from kaniṣṭha to madhyama give that bīja?” You said, “No.” But are you saying now that if you give the order to that madhyama, then…
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: He should give initiation like a peon (postman).
Śrīpāda Bhāgavata Mahārāja: It will come by that order?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: If he follows the order sincerely, then Kṛṣṇa realization may come.
Śrīpāda Padmanābha Mahārāja: Gurudeva, you are saying it is true – you just said it is true – that only the uttama-mahā-bhāgavata can give the bīja. Is that true, or not true?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It is true.
Śrīpāda Padmanābha Mahārāja: So the madhyama cannot give it.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: If the madhyama is sincere, he can inspire them for that. He will tell all these things to him, and inspire them for that kṛṣṇa-sevā-vāsanā to come. [Kṛṣṇa-sevā-vāsanā is the desire to serve Kṛṣṇa purely, the seed of which is the symptom of the bhakti-latā-bīja.]
Śrīpāda Padmanābha Mahārāja: But in some lifetime that disciple will have to receive initiation directly from the uttama-bhakta? Otherwise, it is not possible to actually receive it.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Don’t have any doubt or worry.
They should follow what I’m telling them. They should not think,
“I am guru.”
[To Śyāmarāṇī dāsī] What do you want to tell?
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: When we go to preach, we tell people, “Surrender to śrī guru.” Suppose the disciple thinks, “Yes, my guru, Padmanābha Mahārāja, is śrī guru, that very guru who is talked about in śāstra.”
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: When I am not alive, what will happen?
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: Won’t there be another one coming like you?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: If I leave this planet, what will happen? Will everyone stop giving and taking initiation? What will they do?
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: I am just speaking by siddhānta.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, no. I want to ask you: When I leave this planet, what will they do? Will they initiate, or not?
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: Whatever you desire, of course. But isn’t there another uttama-adhikārī always present on the planet who one should search for?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I think that whether I will tell them to do so or not, they must initiate.
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: “They will anyway,” you are saying?
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I know. So, why not beginning from my lifetime?
In his last days Śrīla Srīdhara Mahārāja stopped giving initiation, and when anyone came to him he told them, “Go to Govinda Mahārāja.” But during my lifetime, if someone really only wants to take initiation from me, I will initiate him.
Śyāmarāṇī dāsī: It was just a question about our preaching.
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They may tell the candidates for initiation, “Your main guru is Mahārāja [Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja].” They may say this during my lifetime. They are free to initiate, or to send the candidates to me; no harm.
[Stretching out the word ‘worried’] Don’t be w o r r r i e e e e d.
Walking with a Saint – Morning Walks and Conversations 2007
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